Big Trouble In Little Zappa Straße

Remember this? The naming of Zappa Straße is rapidly turning into a classic Gail Zappa vs The Rest Of The World type event:

This Saturday, the city of Berlin will dedicate a street to the memory of Frank Zappa. But Gail Zappa, wife of the late rock iconoclast, has threatened to sue the musicians’ collective behind the naming unless Germany’s formally-chartered Zappa fan club withdraws from the event.

Who’s right, who’s wrong?
Here’s Ed Mann‘s opinion, as I received it via email:

I have to say that I agree with Gail – ARF fucked up royally, Just meeting Ahmet is in no way making an agreement with ZFT, nor is having Napoleon sing with Sheik Yerbouti any form of tacit endorsement by ZFT, and for ARF to mention those things as some sort of defense and their “18 years” of all they have been thru with ZFT, ARF did not see this coming? THAT is Dumb.

To be clear: ARF Head is a capitalizing promoter, just like any other promoter. The leader is a super duper capitalist who knows how to make gazillions Euro. Yes he has poured money into Z-nale but he is also building an institution which someday will make him lots of money, he is a guy who understands investment and return, just like Frank did.

I have read some responses in which Z-fans react with this pre-enabled hate towards Gail and ZFT about “being ripped off for ticket money because of Gail” – This is not Gail acting out against the fans, this is the result of the promoters/ARF lack of professional procedure which then leads to bad experiences for fans. For an event this Big – naming a street for her husband, ARF should have contacted Gail formally long ago when this was in the planning stages (they have been into this for a couple of years), offer to fly her over and put her up in a grand hotel, ask her to speak, show her every respect, pay her a great fee, and then get on with it. This BTW is not unusual, the surviving spouses of many great composers required similar – fees, etc.

ARF operates in a big self created arena that is all about celebrating and making money off of FZ’s persona. I recognize that they love FZ to death too and I understand the healing effect FZ’s work has on the post WWII German populace. But if anyone wonders why there is such animosity toward ARF from Gail, I think this example serves to illuminate the big “why”….and now that the event is happening ARF is doing the crybaby thing and pointing fingers at Gail? Really Really Dumb.

It is big-time non-pro fuck-up shit like this that just makes it worse for the Zappa community at large.

— Ed

Kind of puts things in perspective, doesn’t it.

I’ve been following this thing from the sidelines and have to say, Ed Mann makes an excellent point. I still think Gail is over-reacting, thus putting into motion the classic Gail-Zappa-KneeJerk-Fanbase-Aversion-Reaction (can someone invent a word for this, please?). From a PR point of view, even though she may be right in this particular matter, you have to admit she’s communicating terribly in every possible way.

Update 29/07/07: picture of the unvailing of Frank Zappa Street, Berlin. This has been your temporary bogus journalist, reporting a storm in a glass of water.

69 Responses to “Big Trouble In Little Zappa Straße”

  1. mcnastie says:

    no wonder zappa wasted little time worrying about what people were going to think of him after his death. a little over 60 years ago, berlin barely existed due to people largely being fuckups on a grand scale. i’ve got most everything from ‘the lost episodes’ through to ‘civilization phaze III’, and THAT’S the shit that mattered to the man himself. everything else (his distinctive mustache, his quirky tee shirts, his views on aids and recreational drugs, some side street in berlin) adds up to little more than an insignificant pile of shit. i feel sorry for gail that she didn’t take her husband’s advice and get out of the biz entirely. she’s going to be neck-deep in petty disputes with crooked hustlers till the day she dies.

  2. xorg says:

    Gail seems to lack ‘people skills’. She is not apparently opposed in principle to namimg a street after FZ and ARF is all in favour of it too. And I guess none of us FZ fans mind either. So there should not be a problem and it ought to be possible to negotiate a win-win solution. But Gail goes and calls in the lawyers! Duh! How to antagonise people or what?

  3. beepee says:

    I thought it was SOME OTHER music collective that initiated the street naming…and the ARF people were merely providing the entertainment? Has that been lost here or is it not true?

  4. SOFA - Philostopher/Chef says:

    Hmmm. Had the good folks at ARF gone through the proper channels from the outset, then there would not have been a need for any lawyers – at this stage anyway…
    Glad-handing is a fine way to do business, when the scale is more on a personal, or interpersonal, level. Once the ‘business’ achieves a certain level, then a set of rules needs to be accepted as protocol.
    Gail may not be a great communicator afa the Zappa fanbase is concerned, but I think I lean more towards Ed’s description of the promoter(s) being aware of the proper protocol and side-stepping the rules.
    And tho’ I do not doubt for a minute that the ARF people are honest fans of FZ’s music, I have my doubts that they’ve been doing the Zappanale for 18 years out of LOVE… Had this been a true matter of naivete, then they been extremely fortunate to have come this far.
    To many, it is easier to ask for forgiveness than permission – to feign ignorance, or apologize, after the fact. And that tactic often works – once…

  5. Hans says:

    Meanwhile, back in ancient India:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suttee

  6. Frank B says:

    They sell beer with Frank’s name on it, any questions? And don’t forget
    wearing one glove playing drums….

  7. jane23 says:

    Gail-Zappa-KneeJerk-Fanbase-Aversion-Reaction (can someone invent a word for this, please?).
    Zappoplexy.
    She became Zappoplectic.
    p.s. check out the latest VOC submission.

  8. scott says:

    I’ll go with Ed Mann on this one. Should ARF be given
    carte blanche to manipulate/exploit Frank’s work?
    I don’t think so.
    There are a few unhinged, fixated posters on the ZAPPA
    fora who do NOTHING but vitriolically attack the ZFT for
    any stupid thing they can come up with.
    That shit gets REALLLY, REALLLY old.
    When Frank was dying, he should have forsaken his family and bequeathed his earthly estate to Andre Cholmondeley.
    WHO?

  9. urbangraffito says:

    Scott — Agree with you 100 percent on this one.
    There’s a good reason why FZ formed the ZFT before his passing: to protect his family from just this kind of hucksterism. Like it or not, the ZFT have all worldwide (and beyond) rights to everything Zappa. ARF really flubbed it.
    I know that sometimes Gail’s actions may seem overblown to the FZ fanbase, but if she doesn’t periodically set her lawyers on those infringing on her legal rights, those rights will mean nothing.

  10. scott says:

    That’s all I’m saying.
    I think that I could run the ZFT better than Gail,
    but it’s her deal.
    I used to get mad at Frank when there was no album for
    six or eight months at a stretch. But that was HIS deal
    and I could take it or leave it.
    Am I satisfied with the ZFT? When it comes to ZPZ I sure am.

  11. wash your hans says:

    meanwhile, back in not-so-incredibly-ancient Germany
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hitler

  12. tombo says:

    I don’t give a cupcake anymore and will stick to listening to the music. They can git as zappopletic as they wanna. Luve that word, though.

  13. Bob Again says:

    been on a bit of hiatus myself…what’s this supposed to be…back to the front

  14. jim says:

    Ay Carumba!
    Another fine kettle of fish.
    Not sure there’s much point in trying to stop folks from copying the most bootlegged modern artist of them all – especially in 2007. Afficionados will still buy the real deal, as do many curious consumers of 2nd-hand, more low-fidelity matter … I have just seen Trance-Fusion in my teenage-rawk-barn & am prone to scarf it up, even though it’ll be 30 or more Loonies outta my pocket to do so. Why? Mainly due to FREE SAMPLES from Gail’s site, as well as seeing several happy & helpful testimonials on Kill Ugly Radio.
    Is Gail just being crapulent? Shit howdy, I may wish she’d get more of the sleeping monsters in Zappa-Obscura out into the sonic light, but WHOA, she was the man’s WIFE. Considering what sort of subject matter FZ put out, what country she’s in & who’s running the joint, she can’t NOT be a mite touchy right about now.
    Eesh … plainly, Freaks & protocol isn’t a smooth mix, huh?

  15. Paul Sempschi says:

    “…and I understand the healing effect FZ’s work has on the post WWII German populace.”
    I understand how life-affirming Zappa’s music is (including Sucide Chump) but who wrote that paper? I’d be curious to read about this assertion in greater detail, can anyone elaborate on this?

  16. luc Hallaert / Belgium says:

    Oke oke, if they should not name a street to this great musician, then by the first visit to Berlin, i will unbolt the sign, and hang it (with pride) in my room. how about that. Problem solved.

  17. urbangraffito says:

    “…and I understand the healing effect FZ’s work has on the post WWII German populace.”
    Hmmmm, very interesting, indeed. Wasn’t it the very same populace that elected a government in the 1980s that sold chemicals to Iraq so Saddam could rain them down on his enemies? How short our memories have become…

  18. scott says:

    “Wasn’t it the very same populace that elected a government in the 1980s that sold chemicals to Iraq so Saddam could rain them down on his enemies? How short our memories have become… ”
    Oooooo! Very insightful.
    Let’s remember then that OUR gov’t had been(and IS currently) in the vanguard of the propagation of repressive regimes throughout the world. When we try to shift the blame to other countries, it makes us look like an ASSHOLE.

  19. bernard says:

    This – the place where it all happens , East Berlin- might offer one of the clues, the answer to the question ” what’s the importance / meaning of FZ nowadays?”. At the moment ( first decade of 21st century) he’ss popular in Central Europe.
    Try to find out why.

  20. beepee says:

    scott Says:
    There are a few unhinged, fixated posters on the ZAPPA
    fora who do NOTHING but vitriolically attack the ZFT for
    any stupid thing they can come up with.
    Amusing, but misses the point of ZFT criticism.
    Criticism is a good thing, in my humble opinion.
    It’s actually the nutjobs who react in a fanatic fashion that perpetuates it. Or maybe ’cause they feel the need to ‘protect’ the sick?

  21. beepee says:

    A rhetorical question: Ain’t it a bit hypocritcal being a participating member of a blog (KUR) that clearly benefits from the exploitation of the ownership rights of the ZFT? Or does the owner of this site have an agreement I am unaware of?

  22. Montana Wildhack says:

    I love it when people on the net use the word “clearly” as if it was abundantly clear! Spit it out, why dontcha? If you mean the bootlegs freely circulating for free FZ was in favor of such.

  23. beepee says:

    Sorry I was not clear! I’m on a rickety computer at someone’s beach house…rushing. Uh, I was simply pointing out that a few of the posts above rail against the ARF society when here they are posting on an ‘unauthorized’ Zappa website themselves. I find that a bit hypocritical. That’s it.

  24. scott says:

    Hypocritical..? Really…?
    How interesting.

  25. SOFA - Philostopher/Chef says:

    We could be posting the same vitriol at the Zappa Forums – nothing hypocritical about it.
    Arf Effed-up, IMO…
    And I’m not bad-mouthing ARF! These guys have been the vanguard of Zappa Fandom for almost as long as there’s been a Web. The Zappanale is THE FZ event to attend and the ARF people are to thank.
    But they were not “flying under the radar” for this one, knew it (well, the highest powers did), and got busted…
    Like I said, asking for forgiveness instead of permission works – once.

  26. urbangraffito says:

    beepee says:
    “Uh, I was simply pointing out that a few of the posts above rail against the ARF society when here they are posting on an ‘unauthorized’ Zappa website themselves. I find that a bit hypocritical. That’s it.”
    I think you’re sort of splitting hairs here…

  27. SOFA - Philostopher/Chef says:

    An update of sorts:
    Arf responds to Ed, who – in turn – responds to ARF…
    Regards,
    SOFA
    From: yellowshark
    Sent: Friday, July 27, 2007 9:11 AM
    Subject: Re: Gail against the Germans
    Dear Ed,
    Many thanks for these bright prospects, you’re wishing for Zappanales and Arf-Societies future in your email dated July 26, 2007.
    We more than hope your guess – we’ll get a return of investment in the near future – comes true! This will be the safest and only base for all music – and zappa-interested people – worldwide, to enjoy more sophisticated and successful Zappanale festivals in the coming years.
    We are honoured to read, that you really compare our voluntary work with Frank Zappas professionalism and cleverness. You’re absolutely right, saying that we acted naive and really unprofessional when we first tried to make contact to Gail and the ZFT, but even we are learning more about this year after year.
    Do you really believe a more professional behaviour would have had any influence on Gail’s reaction to our simple request of cooperation? I don’t! All she said in a telephone call (oh yes we talked to her personally) is the only chance for cooperation is:
    If she gets total control about who’s allowed to play and all musicians have to subordinate their program under her creativity.
    Thanks again Ed, maybe we see you back on stage in Bad Doberan one of the next years! If all your good wishes for us come true, we should get the chance to get you financed again.
    By the way, Arf-Society has never had, or will have, any influence on Gail’s behaviour. All we do is support her business, as allowing to sell her products at the festival through traders, who are all members of the Arf-Society, without asking any charges for this.
    All of our Zappanale-CD’s and DVD’s are officially registered by the German GEMA, to keep the composers rights and the ZFT is paid by this.
    Come on Ed, who’s got the return of investment?
    We better should tell the fanbase about this.
    Best
    Thomas Dippel
    President Arf-Society e.V.
    From: Ed Mann
    Sent: Monday, July 30, 2007 11:36 AM
    Subject: Re: Gail against the Germans
    Greetings Thomas,
    I do absolutely mean what I wrote and yes I do believe that the building of a Brand is what is going on. Wolfhard knows well how to invest and make money and one day Z-nale will be a money maker…any fans that choose to volunteer are unpaid workers toward this end result. Wolfhard KNOWS how to make money. In the case of Z-nale, FZ is his Brand. And I do believe that the years of problems between Gail and Z-nale has turned to Gail vs. the entire Zappa alumni (save Terry and Steve). Z-nale has played a part in making that worse and it has been going on for so long that now things are worse than ever. Sorry to say this; I do not intend to hurt anyone, but this is the truth as I see it. That ARF did not see this coming (from Gail) for the upcoming street-naming event amazes me. I do believe that before things were in place, the right kind of organization, professionalism and respectful pre-contact with Gail would have resulted in a positive effect.
    So to be positive, take this for what it is worth, ARF would be well advised to bring their activities up to professional standards and not let unskilled volunteers be given the authority to make critical ARF decisions. The way I see it now, as a result of the street naming event and how things have transpired, and Gail’s reaction to it – progress has been set back a good 5-10 years for the entire Zappa community.
    I am just being honest with you.
    Best wishes
    Ed

  28. jane23 says:

    in response to montana wildhacks comment: “If you mean the bootlegs freely circulating for free FZ was in favor of such”.
    Zappa was clearly not in favor of bootlegs. He hated bootlegs and felt they were robbing him of income by putting out concert versions of his new material before he even could. I have personally witnessed John Smothers confiscate cassette tapes from people at a show.
    Beat the Boots!

  29. Montana Wildhack says:

    He was not in favor of SELLING bootlegs. I never said he was! Read my post again; CAREFULLY!

  30. jane23 says:

    ok, i’m stupid, i don’t understand Wild hack Montana’s post. Zappa was not in favor of bootlegs freely circulating for free or otherwise.
    Clearly not Absolutely Free.

  31. Paul Sempschi says:

    I think Wildhack is posturing that Zappa would rather the boots be bootlegged from the bootleggers than for people to pay for them. Then again, he did bootleg the bootleggers himself through beat the boots, so; if you cant be cheap, at least be free (to invert an FZ quote).
    Though he did not like the bootleggers very much and tried to set the FBI on them. However, it seems more likely that the bootleggers were just die hard fans who really cared about the music to put out these bootlegs (the box sets especially would have taken a lot of work, read the linear notes on some of them, there’s a lot of affection and admiration for FZ in them).
    So re: Boots, it’s just the fans taking an initiative that the Zappa objected to, sounds familiar, eh?

  32. xorg says:

    Gail is a control freak. So was FZ. And FZ was ripped off by ‘regular’ record companies and promoters as well as by bootleggers. So I guess the ZFT’s attitude is understandable. But Gail’s approach has tended to alienate FZ’s fanbase and others (such as ARF and KUR) who are motivated by affection for FZ’s music as much as, if not more than, profit. Whereas one sometimes wonders what Gail’s motivation is.
    I still don’t see why this particular episode could not have been solved by negotiation rather than confrontation through lawyers!

  33. scott says:

    Look guys, I totally get the resentment toward the ZFT,
    especially Gail. It’s understandable. From my perspective
    it seems to have heated up after the NON-release of the
    Roxy DVD.
    But it frequently seems unnecessarily vicious and personal,
    not very well thought out, and frankly, CHILDISH. Think about
    it…what is the goal of the criticism? Is the desired result to force
    Gail to change her ways? Let’s be adults about this, that’s not
    going to happen. Take a deep breath, count backwards from 10
    and let it go.
    So then…what? It seems like some of this carping is just awful meanness from individuals who have an axe to grind. Nothing will appease these aggrieved types…they will always find something to cry about.
    Take it easy guys.

  34. mcnastie says:

    allow me to paraphrase ‘the big lebowski’:
    ‘i’m perfectly calm scott…calmer than you are.’
    anyways, let me make the REAL important inquiry of the day – WHERE’S THE FUCKIN’ FRIDAY BOOT, MAN!

  35. scott says:

    true

  36. jane23 says:

    Bootleggers — a species of life that is, in Zappa’s lexicon of evils, right up there alongside Tipper Gore and the PMRC. For while some may consider the bootleggers mere “Zappologists” — diehard fans who taped concerts in locations as diverse as New York, Paris, and Stockholm — to Zappa they are “sleazebags,” and “bootlegging the boots” is his attempt to put them out of business, or at least reap the publishing royalties that are rightfully his.

  37. jim says:

    Yet this hater of bootlegs also released his most immense Magnum Opus onto the airwaves, with explicit helpful instructions as to how best to home-tape it.
    FZ would probably’ve been painting his Synclavier with a big gobful of coffee if anyone put forward such an ABSURD idea in the first place.
    “Sick!”

  38. jane23 says:

    OOR: You’ve always been opposed to bootlegs, but recently you gave permission to FOO-EEE Records to legally release two sets of 10 bootlegs. Isn,’t this giving a certain credibility to them?
    Zappa: No, all I’m saying is, whoever wants to buy bootlegs, should buy FOO-EEE’s, because then, at least, I get paid the royalties.
    OOR: Then why not enhance these bootlegs first?
    Zappa: It is impossible to enhance them. They were recorded with little tape-recorders. You can’t make good recordings from bad recordings. They can only be rendered less inaudible digitally.
    OOR: But even the songtitles are often wrong…
    Zappa: You have to well understand how these records came to be: I never heard these records! A guy at FOO-EEE picks them out. My only input was approving the package. I haven’t heard one single one of them bootlegs!

  39. urbangraffito says:

    scott Says:
    “Look guys, I totally get the resentment toward the ZFT,
    especially Gail. It’s understandable. From my perspective
    it seems to have heated up after the NON-release of the
    Roxy DVD.
    But it frequently seems unnecessarily vicious and personal,
    not very well thought out, and frankly, CHILDISH. Think about
    it…what is the goal of the criticism? Is the desired result to force
    Gail to change her ways? Let’s be adults about this, that’s not
    going to happen. Take a deep breath, count backwards from 10
    and let it go.”
    Scott’s absolutely right.
    We FZ fans are spoiled, spoiled bunch if you ask me. I mean, official releases and bootlegs included, if I were to turn on my iTunes player and start listening to Zappa, it would take me 17 days, 7 hours, and 45 minutes to listen to it all. And that’s not everything that’s available, either.
    Whatever comes from the ZFT is pure gravy, regardless of their business practices. And Ed Mann is absolutely correct: after 18 years, the building of a Brand is what is going on at Z-nale and that Brand is FZ. It is of no wonder that ARF and the ZFT are on a collision course…

  40. Montana Wildhack says:

    My anorak is less jizz-soaked than many of you so I can’t recall where but I swear I saw an interview where he favoured the free circulation of cassettes because if he wasn’t getting the money then no fucker should. This was poss. fairly late on after he had stopped playing live when the releasing of songs onto the market b4 he’d officially done so would have been less of an issue. As it is at time of writing.

  41. Mad Dog Malcolm says:

    Forgive me and inform me if I’m wrong, but is Frank’s music the only music ever in the history of music to be out of bounds for musicians to perform?

  42. jane23 says:

    Montana, you are perhaps thinking about the policy adopted by the Greatful Dead towards the taping of concerts. As I stated earlier I witnessed John Smothers confiscate tapes from audience members.
    Not exactly a positive stance towards unauthorized taping.

  43. jane23 says:

    the ZFT:
    the ZFT is not Frank.
    Frank died.
    Frank is not Frank.
    The music died with him.

  44. jane23 says:

    Mad Dog Mal asks: is Frank’s music the only music ever in the history of music to be out of bounds for musicians to perform?
    The ravel estate had reservations about zappa recording and releasing Bolero. from what i have understand, that is the reason why it was not released on bbynhiyl nor majnh.

  45. scott says:

    Urbane Grafitti says,
    “Whatever comes from the ZFT is pure gravy, regardless of their business practices.”
    How true that is. Believe me, I have been an insane Zappa fanatic for 32 years or so. Every molecule in my body SCREAMS for more new Zappa music. But, back here in reality, there are impediments to that desire. Primarily, Frank is dead. (ouchy!)
    His music and his personality live on in US. His sense of humor and his struggle in the advancement of music are re-edified every time some 15 year-old kid listens to Dyna-Moe Humm. Whenever Alien Orifice “clicks’ in someone’s brain, and they GET IT, Frank lives on.
    Who needs a headstone? Not Frank.

  46. Mad Dog Malcolm says:

    Thanks jane 23, but the Ravel estate objection was about recording and releasing. This whole fiasco is about performing.

  47. Montana Wildhack says:

    Grateful fuckin Dead? Why would I be paying any mind to that bunch of fuckwits? Naaah, Frank said it…later on! Of course the situation with tape trading would change once he stopped touring.

  48. dlokazip says:

    Gail-Zappa-KneeJerk-Fanbase-Aversion-Reaction (can someone invent a word for this, please?).
    Zappoplexy.
    She became Zappoplectic.
    p.s. check out the latest VOC submission.

    How about “Gailbomb”?

  49. Stratoblogster says:

    The Associated Press Release I read about the Berlin Street naming mentions Frank’s brother “Bobby Zappa” writing a letter of praise to the people in charge. Do we have another Hendrix-type family scene here?

  50. Dr.Dot says:

    Jane 23, are you high? It’s “Grateful Dead” not “Greatful Dead”. AND
    To say “The music died with him” makes me want to smack you.
    Idiot.
    Gail is after revenge. Frank cheated on her openly and spent more time with his music than her. Now she is getting hers. 99% of the alumni don’t get along with her, and she likes it like that. More control that way.
    I am trying to smooth things over between ZFT and the Arf Society and the Alumni etc, but it’s not looking good. Gail is an angry woman.
    Arf.
    Dr. Dot

  51. urbangraffito says:

    scotty says:
    “Whenever Alien Orifice “clicks’ in someone’s brain, and they GET IT, Frank lives on.”
    How true you are, scott! As for Gail, this will, of course, sound incredibly naive, but the FZ fanbase should send her one helluva cosmik hug for putting up with all of Frank’s mistresses, especially his main bitch, his music. It’s always the woman who set the tone in the home. If she’s unhappy, no amount of work gets done. Considering FZ’s output…

  52. jane23 says:

    Not Idiot
    Not High
    Not Dot
    Franks music did die with him
    or in case you haven’t noticed
    he hasn’t written much lately

  53. jane23 says:

    I wish I could have fucked anything as hot as gail
    he fucked his mistresses
    he loved gail
    check out the pool photos
    they always seemed so
    happy together

  54. urbangraffito says:

    jane23 is quite right.
    frank might have had sex with groupies whilst on tour,
    but he always came home to gail. what they had was love. you don’t stay with someone for that long a time without it. you can still hear it in her voice in interviews when she speaks about frank.
    if only i had a wife that devoted…

  55. Dr.Dot says:

    Franks music did not die with him. It lives on in his albums, cds, dvds, etc.
    Franks music will live forever, as far as I am concerned. Saying it died with him is ignorant.

  56. urbangraffito says:

    Dr.Dot says:
    “Franks music did not die with him. It lives on in his albums, cds, dvds, etc. Franks music will live forever, as far as I am concerned. Saying it died with him is ignorant.”
    I don’t know if FZ’s music will live on forever, but while I’m alive, Zappa’s music will always be in heavy rotation in my home. Then when I kick off the mortal coil, there’s always my son who is just as rabid a Zappa music listener as I am (hey, if you can’t convert people to Zappa, you can always breed them…lol). Anyway, that brings Zappa’s music at least to 2060 AD. After that it’s out of my hands.
    But, really, the music is never really dead as long as someone is listening to it and performing it. Saying FZ’s music died with him just comes down to plain stupidity. Would the same be said regarding Igor Stravinsky? Or Ravel?

  57. jane23 says:

    franks music died with him
    there will never be a new composition from him
    gone gone gone
    when and if the ZFT manages to dredge up an unheard piece
    it would have to be something he wrote from 20 years ago
    “the present day composer refuses to die”
    but frank is no longer a present day composer
    dead, dead, dead
    and he took his musical invention with him

  58. Jamez says:

    Maybe there’s a composition that was performed once on stage during a tour and has never been released. If it was now then it would be a ‘new’ composition!

  59. urbangraffito says:

    jane23 — your logic escapes me. frank’s music has and still continues to influence generations of musicians. to suggest that his musical invention died with him is absurd. anyone who has ever listened to the works of george duke before and after he worked with zappa can tell the tremendous influence frank had on him musically. frank’s music isn’t dead. i hear it in the music of mike keneally, steve vai, ed palermo, john etheridge, marzi nyman, lexolo, frogg cafe, and mats & morgan. perhaps you might think of listening to some of these artists before you declare the demise of FZ’s music altogether.

  60. jane23 says:

    New from the ZFT:
    the making of the wah wah solo from stuff up the cracks (MOWWSSUC)
    A double CD set
    including alternate takes, Frank tuning his guitar
    and a secret audio tape of Franks trip to Sam Ash Music where he bought the the wah wah in the first place
    order yours today.

  61. jane23 says:

    yes, franks music lives in all the listeners and musicians he influenced
    imagine had he lived how advanced his musical output would be now
    frank always pushed it to the limit
    and frequently beyond
    but now with his death of 15 years
    i have lost hope that we will ever hear anything new from him

  62. Dr. Dot says:

    Jane23,
    you are full of shit. First you say “franks music died with him” then you say “franks music lives in all the listeners and musicians he influenced”.
    Music never dies. That’s what cd’s and records are for. Coming into a Frank Zappa fan forum and saying “frank’s music died” is just plain asking for negative attention. Just like a naughty kid who can’t get attention when he is well behaved, so he acts like a prat to get at least some attention, so your ignorant ploy worked.
    Franks music will live forever. Now shut up and play yer guitar.

  63. urbangraffito says:

    I’m with Dr. Dot on this one. I can’t tell if the 23 on jane23 stands for this person’s age or IQ. These postings are nothing more and nothing less than pissing into the wind…

  64. jane23 says:

    “it’s not important to be remembered, that’s for guys like Reagan”
    –Frank Zappa

  65. jane23 says:

    Frank lived in the moment
    he wouldn’t give a hot rat’s ass if his “music lives forever”
    music on a recording is a dead thing
    similarly, a photo of your mother is merely a representation of a live human being
    ZPZ is injecting some vitality into the music by performing nightly
    in order for music to truly be alive, there must be new thought, new ideas and new performances
    and yes, urbangrafitto, I will dance with you
    but I do not believe you would enjoy it
    sincerely
    Max Urban

  66. jane23 says:

    so
    let’s clear the air
    the point i was attempting to make was
    given another 25 years
    who knows what frank might have produced
    the fact that his life was interrupted at 52
    indicates that he took 1/3 of his output with him
    and it is that portion of his music that died when he did.

  67. urbangraffito says:

    clear, concise and to the point jane23…i too mourn the loss of what might have been produced had frank lived to a ripe old age…then again, he did work like a motherfucker while he was alive didn’t he? considering his output during the time he graced us with his musical presence, i’m one satisfied zappa freak…
    p.s. anybody that can dance to the black page (or attempt to dance to it) can dance with me anytime anywhere blah blah blah

  68. jane23 says:

    i bought freak out with the money from my first gig, 1966
    I have seen zappa/mothers every tour from 1969-1984
    some shows sucked
    some shows great
    and some fucking mind-blowing
    if frank worked 32 hours a day there would still not be enough zappa
    but
    in the mean time
    check this guy out:
    konrad boehmer
    Apocalipsis cum Figuris
    composed in 1983
    very similar to western civilization phase III

  69. moses says:

    did i tell you having the chance to see the ceromony? so for a short time at my homepage – go on news – 12.08.2008 and find it. have fun (we had) and arf…arf… thanks to the orwohaus in berlin.