Can't Play Zappa Live? Why?

[mousebreath]

Frank.  Hear me up in Heaven.  Your wife Gail is abusing your memory and musical intent down here.  Please, come back.  Soon.

Her lawyers are preventing Project Object from playing your music live in little clubs all over the US.  Hell Frank, Project Object was touring whilst you were still with us.

Gail says that your music is so special, that normal ASCAP rules don't apply.  She wants more money or else.

This is putting a stranglehold on people playing your music.  I understand if Project Object were recording your music, but they are only playing it live in dives across the USA.

Please come back and talk a little sense into Gail.  She has gone totally lawyer crazy and it's killing your music.

[Yashar37]

She seems to have become everything he fought so hard against.

[Lonesome Cowboy Squirt]

Hiya, Frankie.

Yeah, I gotta say, there's a lot of people here who are quite pissed about Gail's antics lately.

I stated in another thread:
 
http://www.killuglyradio.com/discuss/index.php?board=4;action=display;threadid=268

my view concerning the lack of output from the ZFT or Barfko Swill.  Perhaps you have read it.  Upon reading it a second time, another point dawned on me.  Your edits were also an integral part of your LPs, so I can understand how someone might have reservations about releasing a CD that didn't correspond to your already vast body of work and to the Conceptual Continuity.  If this is the case, then the ZFT could (at the very least) make a statement declaring not to release anything.  

I recall reading an interview where you stated you didn't give a fuck how you were remembered.  I understand all that about you writing and composing for your own personal pleasure, and those that enjoyed it as well was considered a bonus.  I also recall another interview where you pointed out that some composers end up with their faces plastered on the wrapping of an elitist candy, while others get (at the most) a tiny paragraph in the back of a humongous book.

I, for one, can say this:  that little "bonus" of yours consists of the most highly opinionated, bull-headed, stubborn, caustic, humorous, clever and loyal fan base any musician could ever dream of.  Face it, Frankie, many of us are a lot like you....and guess what?  Its numbers are growing.

Your fan base definitely wants more than a teeny tiny paragraph to represent your contribution to modern music.  You deserve better.  Your fan base is also not satisfied with how the "official" site represents that contribution.  That's why there are so many inofficial sites dedicated to Frank Zappa.  The bottom line is, Frankie, we love you and your music!

A recent Hot Poop entry:

http://www.killuglyradio.com/hotpoop/archives/001844.php

contains comments from someone calling himself "Frank."  Were these, by chance, your comments?  What is your honest opinion about "tribute" groups playing or recording your music?  Do you think your previous employees are doing you a disservice by playing your music?  Do you think they're just riding your coat tails?  Is Gail full o' crap, or is she following through with your wishes?

That's five questions.  I counted 'em this time!  I and several other KUR members would sincerely appreciate your feedback on this issue...or any issue, for that matter.

Sincerely,
LCS  

[SOFA]

I find it less stressful - and therefor healthier - to appreciate what's out there, rather than complain about what "could be" out there. Frank gave us such a prodigeous body of work, after 30 years of listening I still can wrap my mind around it; something new gets discovered with every listen. There are not too many artists that have that kind of effect on me.
Whining and carping about Gail and the ZFT, and what is "owed" FZ's fans, just doesn't make sense to me. I don't feel that Gail or the ZFT "owe" me anything for my 30 years of support. Considering I still get off on stuff that I purchased eons ago, I figure I owe them. I certainly have had countless hours, days, weeks, years of pleasure listening to Frank's music - more enjoyment than I could ever get anywhere else for the investment I made.
So I make it a point NOT to expect anything in the form of new (or unreleased) music from the Vault. When something does get released, like OZ, or Halloween, it's like Christmas; it's a gift. How can you possibly be disappointed with a gift? (Okay, so there's that tie from Aunt Maude that has sat in the back of your closet for 18 years, but hey - it's still in the closet!) Disappointment occurs when expectations are not met. If you don't "expect" anything, you're rarely disappointed...

She seems to have become everything he fought so hard against.

I'd be willing to admit that there's some logic behind this statement, yet - for the life of me - I can't find it.
Then again, I didn't see the logic in posting that "apology" letter at the ZFT. So, rather than foam at the mouth over all of these "injustices" carried out by the dragonlady Gail, I'll just say "I don't get it" (detractors: if you're totally honest with yourself, you'll say the same - unless you happen to be privy to inside knowledge that is straight from the principals) - just as I "don't get" the above statement...
AFA P/O goes, the gray area gets even more gray. The payment of ASCAP fees DOES allow for the playing of other artist's songs in a live setting (this is actually a legal area with which I'm familiar), it has oddly imposed "limits" - limits that are open to judgement, and therefor argument.
For example (and this is only analogous as an example), I sing with a group that pays yearly ASCAP fees to perform the songs we do. We would be allowed to sing any Rodgers & Hammerstein song we want (the R&H publishing house is very active, and not to be taken lightly). But, if our group chose to sing only the R&H songs from their musical "Oklahoma!", and billed it as "The Windmill Chorus Sings 'Oklahoma!", you can bet we'd be contacted by R&H for "additional" royalty payments. ASCAP fees allow you to perform songs; the don't give you license to lift someone's act...
Don't misunderstand, I've seen some of the major (and a few minor) FZ tribute bands and I believe they perform a vital service by keeping Frank's music "alive". But to do what they do, in the openly public way they do it, I'm afraid it falls short of ASCAP accessibility. Let's face it, P/O, BTU, Grandmothers - these aren't just some bar bands that toss in a little FZ on request, or to be different...
And for that, you need permission. If not from the artist, then from the publishing company that holds the rights. If you don't have that permission, then you take the chance of legal action. It's just that simple - and Ike knows this.
I dunno, maybe I'm getting old - maybe there is too much chemical recreation in my past - but, there's at least two sides to everything and I think many of us do ourselves a disservice by embracing one side (that readily suits our present "need") without giving due and thoughtful consideration to the other...
My two cents.

Seeya Frankie!
It's gonna be weird not having you around...
SOFA

[sharleena]

I find it less stressful - and therefor healthier - to appreciate what's out there, rather than complain about what "could be" out there. Frank gave us such a prodigeous body of work, after 30 years of listening I still can wrap my mind around it; something new gets discovered with every listen. There are not too many artists that have that kind of effect on me.

I agree on this.
 

Whining and carping about Gail and the ZFT, and what is "owed" FZ's fans, just doesn't make sense to me. I don't feel that Gail or the ZFT "owe" me anything for my 30 years of support. Disappointment occurs when expectations are not met. If you don't "expect" anything, you're rarely disappointed...

This is true. In my opinion, the ZFT has of course the right to not make anything with the stuff belonging to Frank Zappa, already published or not. But if you know there are odds that he left material to be published after his demise, i think we have the right too for complaining and whinging and even carping, just because we love his music! And we are not asking for private pictures of him with Monica Lewinsky, we are asking for more music, and even for old music and videos that are not available at this point. Is that asking too much? Maybe yes, but i prefer to be there yelling than to be oblivious because i just had enough from him.
Don't you think that if, for example, it would have been public that some descendants from, say J. S. Bach have discovered in the attic a lot of partitures from him, never published before; don't you think there would be legions of people claming and whinging and yelling for them to be published?
On the other hand, what would have happen for example, if John Kennedy Toole's mother would have hold out the novel of his death son, just because it was her "right" to do it? The world would have been deprived of A Confederacy of Dunces, a novel from a true genius.
So: i recognize they have the right to do whatever they want; but i prefer to be here yelling (and showing there's still a market for his music) than to be giving the impression that i don't care about  it.  You can do a very decent rerelease of a video like Dub Room Special with not much money; if not in America in some other place. I'm sorry but this is true.
I don't feel dissapointed though; i actually am very happy with the stuff i have from the guy. But it makes me sick that i can't find in the stores his stuff anymore...

Sharleena

[SOFA]

i think we have the right too for complaining and whinging and even carping, just because we love his music!

A point well spoken, Sharleena. I never meant to infer that fans shouldn't expect more stuff - especially when it's been promised - nor should they remain silent in the face of apparent ineptitude by the ZFT.
I spoke only for me. Sometimes the vitriol of the 'fans' surprizes me - surprizes because I personally don't feel it. That doesn't mean that it's wrong - I symply find it hard to sympathize, and impossible to empathize.

what would have happen for example, if John Kennedy Toole's mother would have hold out the novel of his death son, just because it was her "right" to do it? The world would have been deprived of A Confederacy of Dunces, a novel from a true genius.

A point even better spoken!
Let's take it a step further: what if she had done the above AFTER giving the general public a significant "whif" of what was to come - as the ZFT has done numerous times. Tho' believing in, and trying to live by my earlier comments about expectations, I must admit that I'd be indignant too.
Okay, so maybe I'm beginning to "get it"...
(Two sides to every issue, remember?)
I still think my philosophy is healthier, tho' (I know it is, for me).
SOFA

[Barry]

A little something I wish to add to this discussion:

If, tomorrow, I read a message on zappa.com that they will not be releasing anything anymore, and that's it; well that's when I will stop my whining; because then I'll know I shouldn't be expecting anything, and I should be accepting that.

If on the other hand, I'm being teased with the supposedly upcoming Roxy video on zappa.com ever since 2001, and I have to find out about a "lack of budget" situation through some french guy that posts his email conversation with Joe Travers on an obscure french zappa yahoogroup: well, that's just crappy, and unfair to the fans.

If anything, what us fans deserve is honesty and clarity from the part of the ZFT. That is all we can, and should expect.

[Bob Again]

Barry,

I agree 100%.  I have wasted too much time whining, though.  I've decided to lower my expectations to next to nothing and enjoy what I do have.  As far as I'm concerned, the ZFT has left the building.

Adios friends,

Bob.

[SOFA]

A little food for thought concerning tribute bands and ASCAP fees. I received this from the parent organization of the Group to which I belong:

"If a chapter [Group] has a show that is entirely dedicated to the music of one composer, that show will likely be considered a performance of a “dramatico-musical work” and will have to be licensed separately with ASCAP.

The legal web aint quite so plain, it seems...
SOFA

[bertanya]

It does seem to be difficult to make sense of the situation of the possibility of any new official fz releases, p/o getting tort actions, and us curious seekers findings concerning fz's extant family.

Losing the person you share your life with is probably enough to drive anyone half crazy - in at least the sense of being difficult to understand - whether there's an army of star rangers at your door or not.  I'm in part amused by the idea that gz had expectations of more time with fz, and now she sees, or reads, the reactions of folks with dollars, and can content herself with how it is evidently infuriating to be let down by expectations of more from frankie.  

Does anyone really think more material won't be released ?  What is the job of the vaultmaster, if not to preserve the official recordings, for when the custodians deem the world is ready for their release -  though i guess he could just have a bucket and a mop...

I can think of reasons to be unhappy about this situation, but if pappap999 and gramps5299 ain't complaining, then as we sensitive british might say, at least to ourselves, '...now don't be churlish'.

p/o sounds a more complicated setup, but quite amusing if it's the only teenage rocking combo being hounded by guys in suits.  Barry once posted something in response to some lonesome bert drivel along the lines of don't bite the hand that feeds you, i wonder if this is a similar arrangement.

So if this means that we can't understand where the z's are inspired from, then what is new.  What is it evelyn is supposed to be saying again ?